So, I asked a cryptic open-ended question on Facebook. What's the biggest surprise you've had this year?

Flint Dille Biggest surprise of the New Year so far.

Tue at 7:02am · Comment ·

Michael Floyd likes this.

Scott P. Schomer

???

Tue at 8:47am ·

Robert Daugherty

The implosion of the global warming "consensus/scientific" community. I think this thing will gown down in the history books right next to Piltdown Man.

Tue at 9:05am ·

Scott Miller

I just learned that over 40% of Americans think that evolution is unproven/discredited. Turns out, among modern countries, the USA has among the lowest acceptance/understanding of evolution. But this goes hand-in-hand with the fact that the USA, among modern countries, ranks in the middle of the pack, and continues to fall in ranking: http://is.gd/90VNP And we're particularly low in science.

The USA is truly a falling empire, like so many before us.

Tue at 9:09am ·

Robert Daugherty

So if I don't believe in Darwinian Evolution in all of its various forms I am an uneducated/uninformed noob and am also to blame for the moral and economical collapse of this country? Can't argue with the fact that we rank lower every year when it comes to the sciences but this points to the greater symptom of not teaching our children to think critically and account for all of the evidence before them, which all good science does.

Tue at 9:17am ·

Scott Miller

>>> So if I don't believe in Darwinian Evolution in all of its various forms I am an uneducated/uninformed noob and am also to blame for the moral and economical collapse of this country. <<<

That quite a leap in association there!

The economic collapse of our country has more to do, IMO, with that fact that both parties cater to corporate ...See More

Tue at 9:28am ·

Robert Daugherty

LOL, totally agree, and of course that is the definition of insanity. I would take it one further and say greed, whether for tangible things or power, is what drives our political system today. Both parties here are corrupt, but this is way off course from Flint's orginal posting.

Tue at 9:32am ·

Flint Dille

Thought experiment: is it possible that evolution and intelligent design are harmonious. Every creative process I've ever been involved in has involve iteration.

Tue at 9:43am ·

Robert Daugherty

It is entirely dependent on which definition of evolution you base your observations on. Darwinian Evolution states that given enough time and enough random mutation new species will eventually emerge, which runs contrary to the fossil record. In that record we see complete species and no transitional life forms. Recent discoveries shatter the ...See More

Tue at 9:57am ·

Scott Miller

Flint, but there's no intelligence behind evolution, which has resulted in incredibly unintelligent design across all species. For example--and there are 1000's--in giraffe's the vagus nerve, which controls the larynx, makes a 12-15 foot detour down and back up the neck to reach the larynx, bypassing the larynx by two inches on the way down! Even ...See More

Tue at 10:01am ·

Robert Daugherty

The human eye argument is an old one: http://www.icr.org/article/backwards-human-retina-evidence-poor-design/

Tue at 10:04am ·

Scott Miller

>>> In that record we see complete species and no transitional life forms. <<<

This is so completely wrong.

All species, even those now existing, are transitional life forms. Evolution is ongoing. And the fossil record is very clear on this. In fact, the genetic record is even better proof of this--we don't need to have any fossils to prove that evolution is a fact. But, just as most people do not understand quantum dynamics or relativity, people do not understand evolution either. But, this lack of understanding doesn't stop them from saying it's untrue, only because it contradicts--like so many previous scientific advances--the Bible....See More

Tue at 10:10am ·

Scott Miller

>>> The human eye argument is an old one:

And? It's still a fact. And yes, creationists have had to come up with crazy explanations to explain this away. But, that article is packed with false assumptions and explanations that make no scientific sense. I won't bore you with a full rebuttal, but it would be child's play to do.

Tue at 10:13am ·

Robert Daugherty

Transitional, i.e., a dog becoming a bird. It all goes back to the definition you use as the basis for your argument. Using this definition there are no transitional species within the fossil record, do you know of any examples?

I was a firm believer in Darwinian Evolution until I discovered two complete soft bodied marine fossils (ammonite and a ...See More

Tue at 10:30am ·

Robert Daugherty

Thanks for replying to the article. In this case I will defer to the experts; Jerry Bergman is on the Biology faculty at Northwest State College in Ohio. Joseph Calkins is an Ophthalmologist in private practice, formerly Professor of Ophthalmology at Johns Hopkins University.

You obviously have more faith than I do in Darwinian Evolution :-)

Tue at 10:34am ·

Buzz Dixon

I gave Lady Gaga a listen and discovered I enjoyed her songs far more than I thot I would based on what I'd seen in the media.

Tue at 10:36am ·

Shawndi Lynn

Me too, Buzz. =)

Tue at 10:42am ·

Scott Miller

>>> Transitional, i.e., a dog becoming a bird. <<<

Are you serious??? This is NOT how evolution works.

Your statement strongly indicates you merely have a child-like understanding of the theory. It's as if your own son (or daughter) asked you, "Daddy, how are there people inside the television?" Your question/statement exactly matches this level of innocent naivete....See More

Tue at 11:01am ·

Bill Winter

One of you knows the truth, the other is looking for it. To whom if any does the adage apply: "You ain't gonna learn what you don't want to know."? Thanks for sharing your thoughts guys, I'm genuinely enjoying the read...

Tue at 12:01pm ·

Robert Daugherty

Again what is your definition of evolution? Darwinian, micro, macro, etc.?

Just a few examples can be found here:http://www.christiananswers.net/q-abr/abr-a008.htm

Like you said earlier Scott, I won't bother you with a full rebuttal, it is on all of us to investigate truth claims for ourselves....See More

Tue at 12:38pm ·

Sheryl Scarborough

Me THREE... @Buzz Dixon. She's talented!

Tue at 12:49pm ·

Scott Miller

>>> If you are truly interested in investigating if the Bible <<<

I've read numerous books (pro and con) about the Bible, its origins, how it borrows numerous myths from previous religions (like Noah's flood, monotheism, and the rebirth story--all from Egyptian religion), and I've studied general religion extensively, from a very objective viewpoint, because religion is such a seemingly necessary part of the human experience (for example, great book: http://is.gd/91P57). Whether God exists or not, we would have religion, because people NEED to believe that our life on Earth is not all there is. And humans need the comfort that religion offers, etc.

Keep in mind, I believe in God....See More

Tue at 1:06pm ·

Robert Daugherty

Fact? Indisputable?http://www.allaboutcreation.org/dna-evidence-for-evolution-faq.htm

I, like millions of others, have tested the truth claims in the Bible and found them to be true. I have had many conversations with atheists, agnostics and liberal Christians over the same list you present and what it comes down to is that there will always be one more argument, or they say there simply isn't enough "proof". If God gave them one million proofs they would still want more. For me all of those arguments have been thoroughly disputed, for you they have not.

I would be interested to see a list of the "pro" Biblical accuracy texts you have studied. No offense intended but I would also like to know what God you believe in....See More

Tue at 1:27pm ·

Scott Miller

>>> Christianity is truly unique and provides a relationship rather than a religion. <<<

What religion you are is mostly a function of where you are born and grow up. That's it! If you were born in India, Hinduism would be your religion. If you were born in China, you'd have a few to choose from, but not likely Christianity. And so on.

And everyone thinks there religion is the Real One. So, of course you do, too. But you're right that all religions are man-made. And that's why they all have flaws. Here's one of hundreds in the Bible: On the 4th day, God created the sun and the moon. But, prior to that, he separate light and darkness. Without the sun, where did the light come from? Worse than that, he also created the planets before he created the sun! But the planets would have flown off into space without the sun. ;-) Clearly, this was all written by men given the very weak scientific knowledge they had at the time. But now we know better. If the Bible were written today it would not make so many mistakes like this, and might actually come close to being plausible....See More

Tue at 1:52pm ·

Scott Miller

>>> Recent discoveries shatter the theory that birds evolved from dinosaurs <<<

I forgot to respond to this earlier. And you're right ... it's looking more and more like some dinosaurs arose from birds, rather than the other way around:
http://is.gd/92oiO
...See More

Tue at 3:43pm ·

Mark Henshaw

>>Flint, but there's no intelligence behind evolution, which has resulted in incredibly unintelligent design across all species.

And yet nature has produced lifeforms with capabilities so amazing (from an engineering standpoint) that our best scientists--with all their knowledge and tools--can't begin to approximate them.

We have yet to build a robot that can run, or even walk fast. Sharkskin does a better job slicing through water than the best swimsuit we can manufacture. Birds can perform aerobatic maneuvers that would wreck our best fighter jets....See More

Tue at 3:52pm ·

Robert Daugherty

Plato determined that the Earth was the center of the universe and that "fact" held for 2000 years until Copernicus came along. I think we can all agree that there are limitations to science.

We can look back at scientists throughout time with the understanding that they were limited by their tools, instruments, and available data. In modern times the microscope and telescope have given us insight into things that were previously invisible or unknown. 100 years from now they will undoubtedly look back on us and recognize the things that limited us in our understanding of the universe.

Scott, you just posted a link that posits yet another shift in evolutionary theory, quite a departure from the previously held belief among evolutionary biologists that birds evolved from dinosaurs....See More

Tue at 7:09pm ·

Mark Henshaw

Oh, there is no question that scientists are limited by the quality of their instruments and that our understanding of the universe will improve as our tools improve. But my point is that so long as nature can produce organized structures, systems, and organisms far beyond our ability to understand or reproduce, we must hold open the possibility ...See More

Tue at 7:29pm ·

Robert Daugherty

Mark you said it well. The only thing you left out is the fact that scientists will have to create the raw chemicals out of nothing first.

Tue at 7:49pm ·

Jeremy Irish

There's a geocache on the international space station.

Tue at 9:43pm ·

Christopher Kent

I don't have the energy to get into a debate, but wanted to take a brief moment to back up what Robert Daugherty seems to be saying here.

I've thought for a long time that scientists present their ideas as how reality MUST be... then a few years later things seem to reverse.

From tomatoes being poisonous, to leeching in the middle ages, I like science but take it all with a grain of salt. And I really dislike the arrogance that sometimes accompanies such claims...

Yesterday at 4:25am ·

Flint Dille

Wow What an amazing string. And it started with an innocent question about what surprised you most this year. Well debated point. I'm still not convinced that what we see as evolution isn't just a series of snapshots of the creative process -- or a film missing a whole lot of frames...

I do know one thing for sure. Now that I have a white beard, I have to change my opinion of what God looks like. It ain't this.

On similar lines...

Yesterday at 6:00am ·

Flint Dille

... One of the most fascinating things I've seen this year was a display at the Griffith Park Observatory (well worth the visit)... It was just a series of photo-realistic pieces of art from The Big Bang to Present Day. Started out with darkness... Flash of Light... Stars.. and so on.

Anyway, so my 11-year old looks at it and says: "look, it happens in the exact order as Genesis."

He was right. And trust me on this one. The observatory isn't some Christian propaganda center....See More

Yesterday at 6:04am ·

Robert Daugherty

When the subject of Darwinian Evolution comes up now I try to steer the discussion back to the beginning of the Universe. We can usually both agree that the Universe had a beginning, there is enough scientific (apart from any belief system) evidence in my opinion to confirm this. So then I ask what the conditions at the beginning would have to be...See More

Yesterday at 6:40am ·

Mark Henshaw

I think that we're missing a lot of frames in the film no matter what the right answer is...another reason to keep an open mind. The whole truth will doubtless prove to be far stranger than anything we're imagining right now.

Yesterday at 8:24am via Email Reply ·

Doug Lattery

There are lots of word studies out there about the phrasing of Genesis 1. They mostly all lead to one overlooked thing. "in the beginning, God Created the heavens and the Earth". Bang. There's the flash. The Universe is created and expanding. Things are colliding and forming. then we get to the next verse is (with no time associated) "now the Earth...See More

Yesterday at 11:43am ·

Flint Dille

The thing we need to remember (and pardon me if this reads like Rhetoric 1A) is that the audience for Genesis was a pre-literate tribal group. A scientific exegisis might have gone over their heads. He told them what they need to know in terms that they could understand. The world was not created from an elephant turd from the great elephant ...See More

4 minutes ago ·